Those damn feminists

[ceres]

I'm just kidding, I am a feminist. I hope I have the right forum for this otherwise it can be moved. Here's the deal, one author that I like who has written books on how to do montessori preschool at home (what we are doing) wrote on her blog, "I've spoken before about how as a result of creeping feminsm our culture views girls as normal and boys as aberrant from the norm. We have taken away recess, squashed competition, organized boys' sports - really stripping boys of a lot of stuff they used to go through on their way to becoming men."

What do you think-- is that true? Personally I don't feel thats a feminist thing at all. Why would feminists treat boys as abnormal or take away competition? :confused:

Thoughts?

[Peter Kirby]

Feminist theory correctly sees that language and practice takes boys as the norm and girls as 'the gendered'. This book thinks feminism wants simply to reverse the equation.

[Texas Lynn]

That's a very good, observation, Peter. Thank you.

Traditionally boys were called on more frequently by teachers and they were more agressive academically as well as physically. The decrease in recess time in recent years has tended to coincide with increases in ADD & ADHD. While there are ADD/ADHD girls, it is mostly seen as a boys' disorder.

One thing I agree with Rush Limbaugh on: ADD/ADHD is vastly overidagnosed in the U.S. I'm with some former patients of mine who were accused of medical neglect because they refused to put their son on Ritalin. The dad said the mom was a nurse and they read up on it and decided "all it would mean would be one less gray har [local dialect for "hair"] on a teacher." Later this boy who was 10, was accosted by a cop for being out on the lake in a boat with his 8-year-old brother and 6-year-old sister without either parent and all three kids cussed the cop out. He said the dad was barbecuing on the back patio while he was drinking and he fell asleep.

Educational theories are not my forte but I do think more frequent changes from classroom instruction to more active play and back and forth is good for both boys and girls, but is probably very good for boys of the traditional sort. It may be to some extent educational leaders swung the pendulum so far to accomodate intimidated girls and hurt some boys. Nothing is perfect though.

I do think noncompetetive games are better in many cases. I am totally opposed to dodgeball and other organized brutality and bullying. My son is a sensitive caring boy but he's still all boy. He's not effeminate like Norman Rockwell's "Waldo" character but a boy who grows up to be a SNAG (Sensitive New Age Guy) is certainly preferable to one who would become a blowhard and a bully like certain politicians and evangelists these days, eh?

I liked cheerleading in school because it was fun although it could be competetive too but on such a more limited basis. Some boy cheerleaders who were maybe soft-skinned, I think at least one was gay, lifted us up and did a helluva lotta more physical exertion lifting up us girls very few of whom were teeny tiny than the more thick-skinned boys on the football field.

To some of more traditionalist views, this is what is wrong today: we no longer believe beating up the Waldos is a good thing and many girls prefer to go with a Waldo to a football hero.

There is an 'equality feminist' (her term, meaning that's her focus as opposed to what she calls 'gender feminists' of the Steinem/Dworkin types--I'd just call her a conservative feminist. Her name is Christina Hofs Somers. She says much of what was said in the original post. I think one of her books is even called The War on Boys. I think the concept is rather ludicrous as "The War on Christians" myself. Of course many of the usual right-wing types which tout Somers and take this stuff as gospel truth call school superintendents and principals "liberals" too. I think that's ludicrous as well. IMO being a conservative is a BFOQ for those positions.

If you want to know more read Somers as well as the feminist Letty Cottin Pogrebin's Raising Free Children.

[His Noodly Appendage]

Heh.

No True Feminist...

Fact of the matter is, there are some truly fucked up people out there. A lot of them. They march under the banner of feminism, and are congenitally unable to see male-female interactions as anything put a power exchange.

Do a gender-studies course sometime. The flood of hyperbolic bullshit would challenge even RR's output.

Until you come up with an exclusive definition of the term, any vaguely-popular interpretation is valid.

[Joykins]

I think Christina Hoff Somers does a good job as a balancing act to the the more loony feminist fringe. I tend to think she overstates how boys are shafted in school, but she is correct also that previous publications have overstated many of the problems women face (exaggerated stats about eating disorders, for example, and exaggerated stats about how girls are treated in classrooms). Right now as far as the educational realm is concerned, the girls are dominating. They predictably do better in school and are earning more degrees than men in many fields. It is in the workforce that I believe that women tend to hold the shorter end of the stick, and some of this has to do with work-life balance.

And I do tend to think that the way schools are set up--be quiet, sit still, do your work, be reliable, walk when the bell rings, etc.--tend to fit better with more girls' personalities than boys' personalities, which can lead to better performance on the part of girls. Boys may get more attention in class b/c they tend to wiggle and talk out more. At any rate, I am totally opposed to taking recess and competitive sports out of the school.

Interestingly, as a former nerd, I liked dodgeball--it was one of the few games where my instinctive reaction to any ball coming at mel--flinching away from it--was rewarded.

[BigToe]

"We have taken away recess, squashed competition, organized boys' sports - really stripping boys of a lot of stuff they used to go through on their way to becoming men."

What do you think-- is that true? Personally I don't feel thats a feminist thing at all. Why would feminists treat boys as abnormal or take away competition? :confused:

Thoughts?

Some kids don't have recess anymore (the school behind my house still has it every day)? I don't see how that could be a result of feminism, it seems like an unhealthy move though. Kids need active playtime because so many kids aren't getting enough activity in and developing unhealthy and lazy habits that will be hard to break later. And given that studies have shown girls develop better self confidence and such through competitive sports, I don't see how the squashing competition works either. I don't know if perhaps it's a regional thing, but I see boys still being able to play rough on playgrounds, tons of organized boys' sports but also organized girls' sports and some coed programs, and certainly tons of competition.

If anything, I see these things, if they are indeed happening, as a result of something else. Not all kids are competitive or athletic and I think it's more a result of society finally embracing those kids strengths too, not trying to squash those who like to be more active. I think it's more the whole idea of embracing your individuality and saying it is ok to not be X if you don't want to be, but be yourself and be happy with that.

I say that because in addition to the sports and competitive arenas, now I see programs for kids in other areas that weren't so accessible when I was little.

[Joykins]

Sports cuts tend to come from a lack of funding.

Recess cuts tend to come when schools decide they'd rather have instructional time. There could be incentives for this, like standardized test results having to be YEA HIGH to keep the school funding up.